Wav files + Tag problem...

I just got an 8GB SL, and I've gotta say that I'm very impressed - minus one slight detail. I've ripped all of my CDs as .wav files, and Mr. M6 refuses to read their tags. When I browse in "Music", Every wav file is under "Unknown Artist". And when they play, for example:

[What is actually displayed]
Tool - Lateralus - 12 - Triad.wav
Unknown Artist
Unknown Album

[What should be displayed]
Triad
Tool
Lateralus

I've heard that tagging wav files can be spotty, but is there any way to remedy this? I've used MediaMonkey to tag - 2.5.2, I believe. I dunno, I'm at work .

Thanks in advance!

I don't think tagging wav files is even possible. AFAIK there is no specification on how to do that. So even if MediaMonkey can add some tags other software (like the firmware on Meizu players) doesn't know how to interpret them.

I recommend you convert your .wav files to FLAC. The audio quality will remain the same but the size of your files will go down by almost half! This file format can contain many tag formats: ID3v1, ID3v2 and APE.
Meizu M6 support this format natively and it is quite easy to decode , i.e. it doesn't put much strain on the CPU in a Meizu player so the battery life isn't sacrificed.

um, does cue works for wav?

Yep! I've attached an example I found in my collection. I haven't tested it completely on the Meizu yet, but I can tell you that when I put the .cue file into the \PLAYLISTS\ folder it wouldn't show up on the players Playlists menu.
It appears the .cue file must be in the same place as the songs. And yes, this happens with the latest firmware (2.004.5) so .cue files are supposedly supported.

But I think you really should check out FLAC. You can fit much more music on the player if you use it.

Originally Posted by BaRtMaN

Yep! I've attached an example I found in my collection. I haven't tested it completely on the Meizu yet, but I can tell you that when I put the .cue file into the \PLAYLISTS\ folder it wouldn't show up on the players Playlists menu.
It appears the .cue file must be in the same place as the songs. And yes, this happens with the latest firmware (2.004.5) so .cue files are supposedly supported.

But I think you really should check out FLAC. You can fit much more music on the player if you use it.

Thx for your testing, because M6 series doesn't handle file cache well, so the only lossless format without shuttering or small pauses is PCM WAVE, so, I go for it.

Well crap. How then, do any of these programs see the information I've put onto the wav files? Where is the information saved, if not in an ID3 tag??

Originally Posted by BaRtMaN

I recommend you convert your .wav files to FLAC.

I bought an M6SL specifically because of the wav playback functionality. [Did you know Microsoft's Zune doesn't play their own @#$% file format!] [And yes, I know iPods play wavs .] I know FLAC, I know the pluses, but I don't want to have to integrate ANOTHER format into my personal/professional collection. I record/mix music regularly, and as the default format is wav anyway, it would be just a hassle to have to convert every time.

Having said that, though, this tag problem really sucks! So there's no standard as to how tag info is stored on a wav?

WAV is actually a totally uncompressed disk written version of what's in the memory of something playing it as far as I know. The purpose of WAV isn't really storing any published media, more like very CPU light access to the media.
I think that you should get a proper batch converter program and then convert all of your music while you're at work or so, shouldn't take so much to get them to FLAC, also because WAV's decoding is done nearly in no time.
MediaCoder is a nice free proggy for example.
(And I believe the saved space and all is worth it, and loading a FLAC file for editing into a program shouldn't take much time.)

... I don't particularly want to cave and go with FLAC, but we'll see how long I can stand not having tags . Thank you to everyone for all of the info!

Hi
after hours of wandering the dark dusty corners of the net, questioning overlords of the sound mastering world, and general research, I can offer the definitive word on the subject of CD-A and wav file tagging. The other info pertains to producing master discs which is necessaary for those like me who write and produce their own music.This and more will soon be up on http://www.lastperfectday.com/ and the music is at http://www.soundclick.com/lastperfectday
CD-A recording
CD-A
This is format used for encoding music on all commercial compact discs.If you buy a CD from a store, the music on that CD is stored in CDA format.
The current standard for CD audio requires a sampling rate of 44.1 kHz and a sample size of 16 bits (2 bytes per sample).
You can also change the length of pauses between tracks, enable or disable copy protection and pre-emphasis features, and add an ISRC (International Standard Recording Code) number.

CD-Text
Adobe Audition lets you specify a title and artist for each track. There are CD players that support CD Text display the text during playback.

You need to be writing in Disc-At-Once mode to enable CD-Text writing.
CD-Text is part of the CD+G extension to the Red Book standard for audio CDs. It allows for storage of additional information (e.g. album name, song name, and artist) on a standards-compliant audio CD. The information is stored in the lead-in area of the CD, where there is roughly five kilobytes of space available,

Devices supporting CD-Text
The following recorders are supported for writing CD-TEXT discs...

• Hewlett Packard 7500 / 8100 / 8200 / M820e / 9100 / 9200

Asus Drw-1814blt

Disc-at-Once
Is a writing mode that requires lead-in, program data and lead-out to be written in one (1) write event. Another name for this is "Single Session" recording. All of the necessary information you wish to record needs to be staged on your computer hard disk prior to recording in the Disc-at-Once mode. This mode is usually necessary for discs that are sent to a CD replication facility.
By recording in the Disc-at-Once mode, you eliminate the linking, run-in and run-out blocks associated with multisession and packet recording modes which often are interpreted as "uncorrectable" (E32) errors during the glass mastering process.

Fixation is the process of writing the lead-in and lead-out information to the disc. This process finishes a writing session and creates a table of contents. "Fixation" is required for a CD-ROM or CD-Audio player to play the disc.

Further on tagging CD-A or wav files –

If you are talking about ID3 tags, these are not easily applied to WAV files. In general WAV and Broadcast wav use a different tagging system than mp3, AAC and FLAC.

So if you want to see these tags you won't see them in CD Text from an audio CD (CD-A). Your best bet is to convert them to a lossless compressed format such as FLAC using Media Monkey or something similar and you can flag them in Media Monkey. This is for files on your hard drive.

If you release a CD commercially or a song, then there are ways to upload the tagging information to the Internet Gracenote database where "the rest of the world" can see them, even when they insert the CD, as long as they are connected to the internet. Again, this has nothing to do with CD text.
Currently, Windows media player and Itunes do NOT read this information, even if it is embedded in CD text. Try loading a CD from a music store with your internet connection to the PC turned off. It won't reveal it! So it's not tagging, it is a matter of uploading the information of a commercially released (or to be released) CD to the database first!

You can cut a CD whose titles will be read on a car player that reads CD text, but not on the computer, they don't read that information.

Actually, you were talking about .WAV files. In other words, Microsoft PCM Waveform files (which are already in a standard, without any form of tagging standards included there). Those do NOT support any kind of tagging at all. ID3 tags (if I'm not mistaken) can just sit onto the beginning or end of a music file if made to, but a music player will NOT expect such tags on a WAV file, and thus would either skip them, or concider the WAV file to be erroneous if played.
CD Audio is a totally different thing. There's an international standard on that how to place metadata to the tracks, but it isn't part of a file or anything as CDA doesn't even store music as just simple files (take a look at an inserted CDA in my computer, you won't fine .WAV files lieing there).

Originally Posted by Speeder

Actually, you were talking about .WAV files. In other words, Microsoft PCM Waveform files (which are already in a standard, without any form of tagging standards included there). Those do NOT support any kind of tagging at all.

This is not a fully true. See e.g.
Resource Interchange File Format - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Simply, RIFF-WAV tags is not such widly supported as for example ID3 tags.

Random tag formats can be written for example before the data and if a player knows it may be a case could just look out for that and load tag info. That however wouldn't be liked by other players (prolly resulting in a reported bad file) and so, I think that we may say that the normal WAV files do not support tagging.
You CAN create your own program, or may hunt programs that can write or read their own tagging style, but that doesn't make that really supported RIFF-WAV files are prolly supported by multiple programs, and prolly not by most - including the M6

Please correct me if I'm wrong

Originally Posted by Speeder

Random tag formats can be written for example before the data and if a player knows it may be a case could just look out for that and load tag info. That however wouldn't be liked by other players (prolly resulting in a reported bad file) and so, I think that we may say that the normal WAV files do not support tagging.
You CAN create your own program, or may hunt programs that can write or read their own tagging style, but that doesn't make that really supported RIFF-WAV files are prolly supported by multiple programs, and prolly not by most - including the M6

Please correct me if I'm wrong

Of cause, I did not say about own tagging system. I said, that thare is quite standardized and in some degree supported method of tagging of RIFF-WAV files. And number of programs that supports that tagging is not so small (e.g. Sound Forge, GoldWave, QuickTime, Media Player Classic, ...).